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Gas Tax Opponents Press Their Point

Petition effort continues despite uncertain future of the proposal in the Maryland General Assembly.

Opponents of a continue their efforts to defeat the bill in the court of public opinion.

Protesters gathered along Route 40 and Winters Lane to wave signs at passing motorists and collect signatures on petitions at three gas stations along the intersection.

The gathering Saturday morning in Catonsville was the latest in a number of such rallies this year organized by the Baltimore County chapter of Americans for Prosperity. The group advocates for smaller government.

Hafiz Habib, owner of the BP and Gulf stations at the intersection, said he supports Gov. Martin O'Malley but opposes the gas tax.

"He does a good job for Maryland but this bill is not good for Maryland," Habib said.

O'Malley has proposed a 6 percent sales tax on gas. The money raised would go toward transportation projects.

The fate of the bill is uncertain and Senate President Thomas V. Mike Miller said the bill may not see a vote until late in the session.

If passed, Habib said the new tax would hurt his business.

"Business is down," Habib said. "Higher taxes will drive business down. Gas prices are already very high. People don't have jobs and no income and can't afford the high (price of) gas."

Not everyone who passed through the intersection supported the group's efforts.

One man who pulled away before identifying himself, drove through a gas station parking lot to yell at the protestors.

"We live in a civilized society and we pay taxes," the man yelled from his Subaru Outback. "If you dont want to pay taxes, move to Haiti."

RARE MARYLAND INDEPENDENT March 5, 2012 at 12:45 am
What I find interesting is I know many of these rank and file Democratic members KNOW this is a bad proposal - yet they continue to support it. You need to remember - these were the same mistakes the Republicans made. They stupidly believed we could fight two wars without asking any sacrifice from the people. They knew this was wrong - and they paid dearly for it - rightfully so!
I do not believe we can do much about oil and gas prices right now. Maybe in the future, but not right now. What boggles my mind is that liberals are supposed to be concerned about working people - and the response on this board by the libs is "I have a fuel efficient car, too bad for you!" Here is the problem - how does food get to Giant and Safeway? How does anything get delivered to stores for consumption? What about your Fedex and UPS packages? Big secret - transportation companies LIKE increasing gas prices because if they can time it right, they can put a fuel surcharge on their shipments and do very well on this. Even something as basic as a burial vault is going to cost more. Democrats buy milk and cheese, they buy diapers, they need to bury family members. Just because you have a 40 MPG car does not save you from this. So my question is, with all of the waste that the state has, how can anyone support a gas tax now? If the Democrats are looking out for the little people, this clearly will hurt them more than wealthy independents like me.
DARRELL HAMMERBACKER March 5, 2012 at 12:51 am
While all of you keep bickering here let's begin on how this all began.Jimmy Carter started all this with the first gas crisis when he allowed the fall of the Shaw of Iran ,Carter a Democrat.Reagan came in showed the World the USA wasn't going to take any more bulldooky anymore and bam!!! We came out of the ashes of the Carter Administration,Reagan once a Democrat now a Republican.Every Democrat today keeps blaming George Bush, Republican.When in fact Nancy Pelosi Democrat ran her lips about a possible fuel Crisis when she took over the House could ruin our Economy,quess what! the Arabs started raising prices thus causing the Housing crisis because people couldn't pay their Mortgages because they needed fuel for their cars and home heating fuel .Now Obama has ruined the Oil Drilling Industry,the Coal Industry the Pipe Line from Canada,every Obama backed Solar Company his Administration gave Billions to have failed,no body wants a electric Vehicle that needs 24hr charges to go 100 miles.The Democrats have ruined this Country in less then 6 years you can see it everywhere in local Governments run by Democrats with their tax and fee scams,money that is legally stolen from the average American Citizen.Maryland will never change as long as the Democrats keep control and those of us know why that is.
Lorna D. Rudnikas March 5, 2012 at 12:54 am
Geez Paul, you started out to be so nice....now its "tired old brain out to pasture"....looks like you have picked up some bad habits. Not to worry about throwing insults...this too shall pass. :-)
Lorna D. Rudnikas March 5, 2012 at 01:01 am
Hi Tim, I don't blame President Obama for the high prices....but I do question why he is not immediately making bigger plans to put us in the future "driver's" seat of our own resources and, of course, he is not the one and only soothsayer behind this boondoggle...he has lots and lots of support in that area...with what agenda one might ask.....my perception, of course.
RARE MARYLAND INDEPENDENT March 5, 2012 at 01:02 am
True - and Obama must be held accountable and hopefully he will be. He is the man in charge now. That being said - as an inependent, Bush and Obama are 1 and 1A as far as the worst Presidents ever. Republicans better understand that.
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 01:05 am
RMI, a tractor trailer that gets 4 mpg and has a 10 % fuel price increase is not even a significant decimal point on the cost of goods to market. It affects the minimum wage earner mor than anyone else.
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 01:08 am
Sorry Darrell, the first gas crunch was October 1973. I think the President was Gerald Ford due to Nixon's small problem. Now apologize to President Carter, please. Facts matter.
Lorna D. Rudnikas March 5, 2012 at 01:10 am
I see the housing crisis a little differently.....when it looked to government like pushing banks to loan money to folks who were unable to afford it, and folks willing to sign the dotted line on loans they knew they would not be able to afford...both knowing that the slightest increase in interest would surely end their home ownership...and Fanny Mae and Freddie Mac with the government's blessing in charge of it all...Heck, was a receipe for disaster that a grade schooler could easily foresee. Interest rates up even a point, jobs lost, etc. and now a lot of finger pointing. And so, depending upon who is on first and who is on second determines the direction of the finger pointing. We all are pretty sure both sides of the aisle can take the blame for sleeping at the wheel. Just my humble perception, of course... but a side of the coin for which we are all suffering.
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 01:11 am
Geez Lorna, you start out with the "honey child" and "darling" condescending comments and now you are offended? I am very nice, just not nice when you are not nice. If you want to have a factual discussion, great, but leave your condescending comments elsewhere.
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 01:13 am
My error, Nixon was not yet tossed.
Lorna D. Rudnikas March 5, 2012 at 01:19 am
Lord Have Mercy Paul...you are offended by the term "honey child." You find the term "honey child" condescending and just not nice. Wow, won't change my use of the term.. but, I apologize to you for interpreting what was not meant. Certainly when insults fly (name calling is probably top on the list) it is usually when one reaches for the bottom of the barrel to cause discomfort. I just don't recall you reaching in that direction in the beginning, if anything, you chose to rise above it. You can call me honey child and darling any time...but lets leave the insults at home.
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 01:23 am
Lorna, those terms are condescending and you use them frequently. I find them offensive. Stop using them and I won't insult you in return. Fair enough?
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 01:32 am
Lorna, as I was involved intimately in the homebuilding boon during 2000 - 2006, I have more knowledge than most what went down in the PH area. The average homeowner had no idea what they were agreeing to, they just knew a mortgage broker or mortgage lender was going to give them their dream home. They also felt that prices had never collapsed before, so why not was their thought process. Then Oops happened. The mortgage brokers were making a mint and people were willing to pay ever increasing prices for new and existing homes. All was good. Then kaboom.
RARE MARYLAND INDEPENDENT March 5, 2012 at 01:34 am
So Democrats will admit this will impact minimum wage earners. It would also affect senior citizens. You can't simply say, oh a 6 or 7% increase is minimal. It is the 6 or 7% increase on top of the soaring prices - and the fact the no effort was made to hold the line on spending.
The working class tax cut is going into everyone's tank.
Scott Sewell March 5, 2012 at 01:44 am
Paul, just google: Bush Chaney oilmen. There are thousands of links attributed to democrat bloggers & politicians like your idols Maxine Waters, Nancy Pelosi, Al Sharpton & numerous others. Plus, I heard it in person from democrats like yourself. So apologize, and please stop using tactics from "Rules for Radicals" when addressing me by name. Sorry, but I refuse to take the bait and stoop to that level.
I enjoy constructive debate on issues of the day, but take offense to being labeled a liar because I refuse to follow the socialist mentality of more & bigger government.
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 01:57 am
Sorry Scott, you are a liar, you accused me of saying something I did not say. By definition you lied. Man up.
Lorna D. Rudnikas March 5, 2012 at 01:59 am
Sorry you find them offensive...I find your attitude unfortunate...but rather than change my speech pattern to suit you, I simply won't participate in communication with you. Fair enough?
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 02:02 am
C'mon RMI, if you use 20 gallons a week that is 4 bucks a week. The poor get affected the most, the rest is background noise. I have never said I like the tax increase, just the opposite, I don't like the trend of ever increasing spending by Ehrlich or O'Malley. It needs to stop. If Republicans could leave their social agenda at home they just might win in MD.
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 02:11 am
Fair enough.
Scott Sewell March 5, 2012 at 02:41 am
"The point is Paul, that when the gas went up then, you liberals told us that it was because Bush & Chaney were oilmen. So what is your excuse now?"
Paul, the term YOU LIBERALS is a generic statement and you know it, so stop with your juvenile semantics, and name calling. You're pretty brave calling someone a liar from the comfort of your computer. So, like Lorna, I am done with you too. Why do I have the feeling that you are also known as Robert Armstrong?
Buck Harmon March 5, 2012 at 02:57 am
The housing market...boom if you will has been a greed driven deceptive scam on the consumer for the last 20 years. The vast majority of developed housing was designed to offer the lowest quality possible....marketed at the highest possible price.
Developers slapped together thousands of plastic shacks that were built to minimum standards at best, (minimum code requirement). These plastic shack development's were masterfully marketed with beautiful model homes, coupled with shady lending practices. Unknowing consumers bit the carrot and made what amounts to most, their largest life investment believing that they were getting a fair dollar value. Homes built to minimum standards are not energy efficient regardless of how deceptively they have been marketed. Energy Star appliances are an illusion that the gov. participated in to help with this huge consumer deception. I do not refer to the custom home market here, but rather, the majority of homes built in perceived affordable developments. By design, the consumer got screwed and the price of greed amounts to very high cost to live in and maintain these plastic shack homes. To date I have not seen a well done residential housing development that put the dollar value for the consumer ahead of excessive profit.
Buck Harmon March 5, 2012 at 03:22 am
It would seem that by re-hashing past problems which have contributed to the current dilemma being faced with regard to fuel we have a stale mate....at least on this blog.
How about some creative brain storming in place of the very creative jib a jab stuff. I believe that we have a lot of really great talent committed to many of these types of blogs.....we should seek solutions in place of blame....just a thought..
Lorna D. Rudnikas March 5, 2012 at 03:38 am
And a very good thought!!!
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 11:42 am
Goodbye Scott. I don't know Robert Armstrong although I have seen some of his posts. Probably not his real name, I use mine. Whether it is from the comfort of my computer or in your face, the statement would not change. You use the term "you liberals" as a pejorative and then you call my semantics juvenile? BS.
Have a good day.
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 12:21 pm
Buck, I agree with some of your post but heartily disagree with others. I was a semi-custom homebuilder and real estate developer from 1997-2005 during the boom/bust of the real estate market.
First point, developers and homebuilders have 2 complete separate functions in real estate and usually they are 2 non-affiliated companies. The developer buys the land from the owner, processes development plans through Baltimore County and after approval, puts in the utilities, roads and storm water management. The homebuilder buys the finished lots from the developer pursuant a contract negotiated between the 2 of them. The homebuyer buys finished lot and finished home from the builder after it is completed. Everyone along the food chain is trying to pay as little as possible for what they are buying while the seller is trying to sell it for the maximum amount possible. Just good 'ole capitalism at work. The buyer of the home was trying to sell their existing house at the maximum price as well. Regarding fair value for the biggest investment of their life, price paid and value received is nothing but a perception, no reality. The house is worth what a willing buyer and willing seller agree upon. Prices were going up almost weekly, both in the new home market and the resale market. In actuality, as more homes are sold in the resale market, the bust was more prevalent there. Regarding quality, homes are built to a "minimum" building code. Continued.....-->
Paul Amirault March 5, 2012 at 12:26 pm
Continued ...... --> This building code has been getting stricter every year. The latest revisions include higher insulation values and fire sprinklers in single family housing. I can't speak for every homebuilder, but the homes built today are of better quality than the homes built 30-50 years ago. There are exceptions, but as a general rule, today's homes are more energy efficient.
Lastly, you asked to see a high quality development in Perry Hall. I suggest you visit the community of Shadowcreek in Perry Hall. It is just north of the intersection of Bangert and Forge Haven. Sorry for the long post.
Computer Techy March 5, 2012 at 12:48 pm
Wow. What a waste of time reading all this nonsense. Bottom line, toss them all out, reduce the size of government and their spending. Stop with all the tax. 1776 will repeat itself if government doesn't wake up. Like then, people are tired of being robbed!
Buck Harmon March 5, 2012 at 01:34 pm
Paul, We should create a blog that could fully address the issue of housing for the masses. I come from a background of 36 years of historic restoration experience and have studied the new housing market intensely as a side line. I have restored homes for 2 VP's at KCI, a nationwide development engineering firm, and fully understand the process. It really doesn't matter how many different professional entities participate in the illusion... bottom line is that during your timeline of involvement, the VAST majority of families that purchased new homes in perceived affordable developments got screwed by design.Many,if not most of these home purchases were made by first time home buyers... young couples , with small children, just starting out. You are RIGHT Paul, these homes were priced based on getting the maximum amount that the geographic location would warrant, and had very little to do with the quality or materials that were used. The larger, more successful the developer/builder, the broader the grey zone of walking the bottom line regarding minimum code requirements. This gas tax blog is probably not the place to continue the housing debate, but I would challenge both you and Patch to an in depth, fact filled debate with regard to this very important topic.
Homes built to minimum requirements, sold for maximum dollars have literally broken the backs of thousands of young couples just starting out. Not at all something to be proud of. We can do better.
Buck Harmon March 5, 2012 at 01:48 pm
I look forward to a repeat of 1776....long overdue...
Richard Hiteshew March 5, 2012 at 07:35 pm
Just an observation. the first refuge of scoundrels and despites alike is to attack the messenger regardless of the source or facts. It is the facts that matter, not who brought them forth. As long as they are true, that's the important thing.
The Governer of Maryland has very broad discretions of spendning of funds. If the Governer has a likeminded House Speaker and leader in the Maryland Senate, we essentially have a three person Government. Remember, four of the richest counties in America are in the state fo Maryland. By any means, it is not a poor state; therefore, a "we can afford it" attitude prevails amoung Legislators. That's the way it is in Maryland, like it or not. As for the price of gasoline, I have several observations. The price of gasoline in Europe has no relevence anymore than the price of gasoline in Madagascar. I've been to Europe many times, and the countries are very different. My wife could always find me on Avenue St. Michael. That's because I along with many Germans and Scandinavians am at least a foot taller than most Frenchmen. My fourteen year old daughter was taller than anyone in the family where we stayed. Frenchmen and Italians and other Europeans can fit in these small cars. At 6' 2", I cannot fit in a new smart car along with many small cars on the market today.

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